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Author Topic: Allium 2011  (Read 33879 times)

johnw

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Re: Allium 2011
« Reply #45 on: May 28, 2011, 03:02:49 PM »
Can you believe it has taken us this long to be brave enough to try Allium prattii ACE 2394 outside?  It has wintered just fine and we now have back-ups in separate pots.

Allium species - cw Gang-ho-ba, Lijang, China, 3450m to 70cm, in screes - id'ed by Afloden on SRGC as prattii.

johnw
John in coastal Nova Scotia

TheOnionMan

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Re: Allium 2011
« Reply #46 on: May 28, 2011, 03:18:54 PM »
Hi John,

If we're talking about the plant near the center with the white stripe down the center of the leaves, I'd say the ID is Allium ovalifolium var. leuconeurum.  What color are the flowers?  In ovalifolium there are white to pinkish white, whereas in prattii they are pink to red-purple.  The leaves of A. prattii can be variable (per the description in Flora of China), but most often they are long blade-shaped leaves, see: http://www.efloras.org/object_page.aspx?object_id=87653&flora_id=800
http://www.efloras.org/florataxon.aspx?flora_id=2&taxon_id=200027521

In my plant, which I had from Chen Yi (misidentified), the flowers are deep red.  Both species have been perfectly hardy outside since I got them about 10 years ago.
Mark McDonough
Massachusetts, USA (near the New Hampshire border)
USDA Zone 5
antennaria at charter.net

TheOnionMan

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Re: Allium 2011
« Reply #47 on: May 28, 2011, 03:24:11 PM »
Wonderful Alliums everyone!

Some Alliums flowering here now:

Allium akaka
Allium litvinovii
Allium nevskianum
Allium platycaule

and an Allium which I bought together with A. platycaule. Could it be A. akaka too?

Wim, your unidentified allium looks like a pale small-flowered form of A. karataviense, I don't think it is A. akaka.  I grew a number of forms of A. karataviense from various collections sent to me by Arnis Seisums, and one was a very pale small-flowered plant that looks very similar to your plant.
Mark McDonough
Massachusetts, USA (near the New Hampshire border)
USDA Zone 5
antennaria at charter.net

TheOnionMan

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Re: Allium 2011
« Reply #48 on: May 28, 2011, 03:28:44 PM »
very small and long flowering, Allium hierochuntinum, from Israel and Jordan, near the dead sea

Fred, exquisite photo of Allium hierochuntinum!  Thanks also for showing us more middle eastern treasures like A. rothii and A. libanii, I have lusted for A. rothii for decades.  And it is good to show the true A. libanii, as it appears frequently in the seed exchanges but it is always the grand usurper of allium species; A. senescens.  And Rafa showed Allium tel-avivense, another excellent middle eastern species that probably can't be grown here :'(
« Last Edit: May 28, 2011, 03:33:40 PM by TheOnionMan »
Mark McDonough
Massachusetts, USA (near the New Hampshire border)
USDA Zone 5
antennaria at charter.net

johnw

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Re: Allium 2011
« Reply #49 on: May 28, 2011, 03:34:22 PM »
Hi John,

If we're talking about the plant near the center with the white stripe down the center of the leaves, I'd say the ID is Allium ovalifolium var. leuconeurum.  What color are the flowers?  In ovalifolium there are white to pinkish white, whereas in prattii they are pink to red-purple.  The leaves of A. prattii can be variable (per the description in Flora of China), but most often they are long blade-shaped leaves, see: http://www.efloras.org/object_page.aspx?object_id=87653&flora_id=800
http://www.efloras.org/florataxon.aspx?flora_id=2&taxon_id=200027521

In my plant, which I had from Chen Yi (misidentified), the flowers are deep red.  Both species have been perfectly hardy outside since I got them about 10 years ago.



Mark -  Yes the centre one with the striped leaves.  It certainly does not look like prattiii.  Here is an old photo.

johnw
John in coastal Nova Scotia

TheOnionMan

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Re: Allium 2011
« Reply #50 on: May 28, 2011, 03:44:43 PM »
Oh yes, then you most certainly have Allium ovalifolium var. leuconeurum; love the pink stamens. 

Interestingly, when I received a few bulbs of what was identified as A. aciphyllum from Chen Yi, the dang thing resulted in three separate species; A. ovalifolium var. ovalifolium, Allium ovalifolium var. leuconeurum (which I have since lost), and the red Allium prattii.  I'm glad that I still have the first and last of those three.  Last year I separated them, and finally have more of them coming along... I find this group of Chinese Alliums to be rather slow growing and for some reason the seed rarely germinates for me.
Mark McDonough
Massachusetts, USA (near the New Hampshire border)
USDA Zone 5
antennaria at charter.net

johnw

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Re: Allium 2011
« Reply #51 on: May 28, 2011, 03:54:53 PM »
Oh yes, then you most certainly have Allium ovalifolium var. leuconeurum; love the pink stamens. 

Interestingly, when I received a few bulbs of what was identified as A. aciphyllum from Chen Yi, the dang thing resulted in three separate species; A. ovalifolium var. ovalifolium, Allium ovalifolium var. leuconeurum (which I have since lost), and the red Allium prattii.  I'm glad that I still have the first and last of those three.  Last year I separated them, and finally have more of them coming along... I find this group of Chinese Alliums to be rather slow growing and for some reason the seed rarely germinates for me.

Many thanks Mark. If someone is going to the States in the autumn I will send along a bulb to post.  No seeds here either on the ACE Alliums.

johnw
John in coastal Nova Scotia

TheOnionMan

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Re: Allium 2011
« Reply #52 on: May 28, 2011, 04:10:14 PM »

Many thanks Mark. If someone is going to the States in the autumn I will send along a bulb to post.  No seeds here either on the ACE Alliums.

johnw

Sounds good.  I do occasionally get seed on ovalifolium var. ovalifolium, and always get good seed set on A. listera (a finer relative of A. ovalifolium), but only one seedling in about 8 years with the latter species has ever appeared; not sure what the trick is to getting these to germinate.
Mark McDonough
Massachusetts, USA (near the New Hampshire border)
USDA Zone 5
antennaria at charter.net

PeterT

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Re: Allium 2011
« Reply #53 on: May 29, 2011, 11:47:32 PM »
Allium ovalifolium (I dont know the subspecies) clumps up for me and self seeds. It has set seed every year for five years.
living in Derbyshire, England

TheOnionMan

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Re: Allium 2011
« Reply #54 on: May 30, 2011, 02:01:54 AM »
Allium ovalifolium (I dont know the subspecies) clumps up for me and self seeds. It has set seed every year for five years.

Thanks Peter.  But do the seeds germinate?  I get good seed set on A. listera, but it almost never germinates.  Someone sent me seed of A. ovalifolium last year, it has not germinated yet.
Mark McDonough
Massachusetts, USA (near the New Hampshire border)
USDA Zone 5
antennaria at charter.net

PeterT

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Re: Allium 2011
« Reply #55 on: May 30, 2011, 08:16:46 AM »
Allium ovalifolium (I dont know the subspecies) clumps up for me and self seeds. It has set seed every year for five years.

Thanks Peter.  But do the seeds germinate?  I get good seed set on A. listera, but it almost never germinates.  Someone sent me seed of A. ovalifolium last year, it has not germinated yet.
Yes there are seedlings around the clump Mark
living in Derbyshire, England

wmel

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Re: Allium 2011
« Reply #56 on: June 02, 2011, 07:48:45 PM »
Hello,

I am new on this Forum and trying to find out how everything is working.
To start please excuse me when my english is not always correct. A long time ago I had english at school, but after that I only talk sometimes or read(on tv).
I come from the Netherlands and live on a farm in the village Creil.
We grow about 17 hectare of Tulips and in the winter we have about 2000000 tulips for cutflower al going to the flowerauction in Aalsmeer (Flora Holland)
Next to that we have started collecting  allium for 25 years now, resulting in a collection of more then 350 varietys.  About 20 years ago we also started to cross allium. At this moment we grow over 25 new allium, some of them are already  on the marked ( Summer Drummer, Ping Pong, Pink Jewel, Spider) and others will be in the comming years  (Hairy Friend, Pink Lady, Purple Mystery, Dark Eyes), and hopefully more to come…….
We show our allium every year on the weekly KAVB Flower Show, and this Forum was brought to our attention by Luit van Delft, who always uploads photos to this forum.
Last week we looked on a lot of pages about allium and saw very much photos of very beautiful alliums we never have seen before, We read a lot of comments an I think there is much to learn about allium for me here…….
Wietse Mellema
Wietse Mellema, Klutenweg 39 I, Creil  Netherlands
Bulbs and bulbflower grower of allium and tulips

Maggi Young

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Re: Allium 2011
« Reply #57 on: June 02, 2011, 07:55:58 PM »
Hello Wietse, it is very good to have you join the Forum.

I have read (in translation) http://www.wmel.nl/?pagina=2 .... about your nursery and growing history, which sound very interesting.

It will be good to learn more about your Allium cultivars and  of course we hope you will find things of interest from the Allium lovers of the Forum.
Margaret Young in Aberdeen, North East Scotland Zone 7 -ish!

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PeterT

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Re: Allium 2011
« Reply #58 on: June 02, 2011, 08:07:13 PM »
Welcome Wietse, I should be glad to hear and see your Alliums
Peter
living in Derbyshire, England

wmel

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Re: Allium 2011
« Reply #59 on: June 02, 2011, 08:33:00 PM »
Hello Wietse, it is very good to have you join the Forum.

I have read (in translation) http://www.wmel.nl/?pagina=2 .... about your nursery and growing history, which sound very interesting.

It will be good to learn more about your Allium cultivars and  of course we hope you will find things of interest from the Allium lovers of the Forum.



Thank you Maggi, I hope to learn a lot on this Forum, and ofcourse I like to tel/show (almost) everything I know about Allium. In the last few years I have made about 2000 Photos of allium (a lot you will find on my webpage http://www.wmel.nl/?pagina=3&tp=6 ). We are stil working on our website but it takes very much time, and as we do not have any permanent personal (in busy periods we work with students, poolish people and in the winter with 6-8 woman/wife's of other farmers in our village) It is not our most inportant work to update al the allium photos on our website. But if anyone wants to see a picture of a allium from my collection please ask, and I will see if I have one and put it on this Forum.

Welcome Wietse, I should be glad to hear and see your Alliums
Peter


Thank you Peter I will try to do the best I can

wietse
Wietse Mellema, Klutenweg 39 I, Creil  Netherlands
Bulbs and bulbflower grower of allium and tulips