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Author Topic: Are they fertile?  (Read 35948 times)

Diane Clement

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Re: Are they fertile?
« Reply #15 on: June 21, 2011, 01:30:27 PM »
And for those who have asked, there is no seed on my plants, sorry  :'(
Diane Clement, Wolverhampton, UK
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Diane Whitehead

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Re: Are they fertile?
« Reply #16 on: June 21, 2011, 11:27:26 PM »
Elaine  Chittenden, the Manager of Living Collections of the Lyman Conservatory at Smith College,
wrote to thank me for letting her know about the incorrect photo of Hylomecon on their website.

She says they received the Stylophorum lasiocarpum seed from the Scottish Rock Garden Club
in 2000 labelled Hylomecon japonicum.

I guess they would appreciate having the true plant in their botanic garden.  Unfortunately, I
don't know of anyone who grows it, though many of us have tried to get the real thing.

I wonder how this long-standing imposter can be foiled.  Would it work for all seedexes to have
a five year moratorium on "Hylomecon" seed.  Meantime, those few people with the true plant
could be distributing it to public gardens in their area.  From then on, only guaranteed true seed
could be distributed. 

Diane
Diane Whitehead        Victoria, British Columbia, Canada
cool mediterranean climate  warm dry summers, mild wet winters  70 cm rain,   sandy soil

Lesley Cox

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Re: Are they fertile?
« Reply #17 on: June 22, 2011, 01:43:36 AM »
Well Gunilla definitely has the true plant and I think Gote Svanholm also has it. The maddening thing is that a wholesale nursery just an hour down the road from me also has it, and I have had it from them (see remark about drought sensitivity) but they no longer sell to the public and it's not a plant they propagate for garden centres. I could offer diamonds in exchange but I think their proprietor already has many more than I have.
Lesley Cox - near Dunedin, lower east coast, South Island of New Zealand - Zone 9

David Pilling

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Re: Are they fertile?
« Reply #18 on: June 25, 2011, 03:55:57 PM »
Hi,

Seed of Primula Kisoana is often Primula Polyneura and of Primula Jesoana, Cortusa. So if you want, Cortusa you ask for P. jesoana.

Therefore what one needs to know is what seed of Hylomecon is sent to the seed ex as, maybe some sort of anenome with yellow flowers.

I wonder if the seed exs could offer seed with a symbol to denote the person submitting it had applied a key to the plant. Currently it is common to have say seeds of various colours of species as separate selections, so not much extra work.

There would then be some incentive for people submitting the right seed, at the moment as I understand things you might submit the right seed and it doesn't happen to get used.


« Last Edit: June 25, 2011, 04:27:28 PM by David Pilling »
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Lesley Cox

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Re: Are they fertile?
« Reply #19 on: June 25, 2011, 11:50:02 PM »
In my own case David, the several times I've asked for Hylomecon and invariably received Stylophorum,  the seed could have been Hylomecon, always small black seeds such as one might expect from a poppy relative. Those who receive the seed for the exchanges could not possibly be blamed for not recognizing it as NOT Hylomecon. The onus here is on those supplying the seed to search for pictures of the two plants and decide which is correct. I imagine one person, perhaps many years ago has made the initial mistake and the Stylophorums (both species) have been re-distributed incorrectly time and again with no-one knowing or caring enough to make a fuss about it. Except me. ::)
Lesley Cox - near Dunedin, lower east coast, South Island of New Zealand - Zone 9

Kristl Walek

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Re: Are they fertile?
« Reply #20 on: June 26, 2011, 02:42:21 PM »
The great imposter in the Hylomecon-Stylophorum seed exchange controversy is, in my experience, rarely Stylophorum (a very well behaved and beautiful plant with extremely distinctive seed pods and seed). It is rare in the wild, throughout its range and endangered in Canada.

Rather it is usually Chelidonium majus, the seed pod more closely resembling Hylomecon, and with seed that is NOT ephemeral. Chelidonium is a rampant plant in the garden & easy from seed. Seeds are distinctly poppy-like.

I do not have a picture of Chelidonium pods---but found this one online, for someone to verify

http://www.flickriver.com/photos/flatbushgardener/168037974/

Despite the vague similarities in the plants, it would be very hard, indeed to mix up Stylophorum diphyllum at the seed pod (or the seed) stage.

Neither Hylomecon nor Chelidonium have the distinctive aril found on Stylophorum diphyllum seed, nor are the seed pods chubby and bristly.

I am attaching pictures of the Stylophorum diphylla collected this morning, which will now be immediately moist packed, as it is ephmeral.

« Last Edit: June 26, 2011, 02:58:27 PM by Kristl Walek »
so many species....so little time

Kristl Walek
Gardens North Seed


www.gardensnorth.com

Lesley Cox

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Re: Are they fertile?
« Reply #21 on: June 26, 2011, 09:45:06 PM »
Yes that's the S. diphyllum all right. And I've been given it a few years ago as S. diphyllum, so no problem there. It grows, is perennial and sets tons of seed which self sows but also germinates well if collected and sown in a pot. I have NOT found it ephemeral, or at least it still germinates well when the aril has dried up and the seeds are smaller and quite dry. Otherwise my donor's seed wouldn't have germinated and nor would the seed I've had as Hylomecon but which were this.

This is the better of the two Stylophorum species in my opinion. S. lasiocarpum is coarser in the foliage, smaller in the flower and generally leggier I think. Both are distributed from the lists as Hylomecon, which it why it is great to find someone like Gunilla who has the genuine plant but it seems it doesn't set much seed.
Lesley Cox - near Dunedin, lower east coast, South Island of New Zealand - Zone 9

Lvandelft

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Re: Are they fertile?
« Reply #22 on: June 26, 2011, 09:58:00 PM »

I do not have a picture of Chelidonium pods---but found this one online, for someone to verify

Here are some, maybe it is helpful?

Chelidonium majus
Luit van Delft, right in the heart of the beautiful flowerbulb district, Noordwijkerhout, Holland.

Sadly Luit died on 14th October 2016 - happily we can still enjoy his posts to the Forum

Diane Clement

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Re: Are they fertile?
« Reply #23 on: June 26, 2011, 10:10:45 PM »
I do not have a picture of Chelidonium pods---but found this one online, for someone to verify
http://www.flickriver.com/photos/flatbushgardener/168037974/  


Yes, this link shows Chelidonium majus seed pods but it is incorrectly labelled as "Lesser Celandine" rather than Greater Celandine.  Lesser Celandine is Ranunculus ficaria.  Both these "Celandines" are invasive weeds here, not to be encouraged.
Diane Clement, Wolverhampton, UK
Director, AGS Seed Exchange

gote

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Re: Are they fertile?
« Reply #24 on: June 27, 2011, 10:18:54 AM »
I do not have a picture of Chelidonium pods---but found this one online, for someone to verify
http://www.flickriver.com/photos/flatbushgardener/168037974/  


Yes, this link shows Chelidonium majus seed pods but it is incorrectly labelled as "Lesser Celandine" rather than Greater Celandine.  Lesser Celandine is Ranunculus ficaria.  Both these "Celandines" are invasive weeds here, not to be encouraged.

Hear hear!!!  These are invasive also here
The funny thing is that I sometimes are warned not to plant this or that invasive species and indeed I do not. I have tried them three times and they promptly died (or at least in the winter.) ???
On the other hand i have seen my worst weeds sold in nurseries!! ???
Göte
PS.
I do indeed have the true Hylomecon japonicum but I do not think I can send any seed this year. It is surprisingly tough but not invasive. A really good woodlander
Göte Svanholm
Mid-Sweden

David Pilling

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Re: Are they fertile?
« Reply #25 on: July 01, 2011, 11:51:36 AM »
At the start of all this, I had my 'hylomecon' identified as  Stylophorum lasiocarpum. Here are some photos of the seeds and pods. These came via the seed ex so also must have some capacity to stand being dried out.

(thread started as http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?topic=2854.msg197753#msg197753)



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Lesley Cox

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Re: Are they fertile?
« Reply #26 on: July 02, 2011, 11:39:31 PM »
In my experience, the seeds of both Stylophorums are NOT ephemeral but maybe the seeds of the true Hylomecon are?
Lesley Cox - near Dunedin, lower east coast, South Island of New Zealand - Zone 9

David Pilling

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Re: Are they fertile?
« Reply #27 on: July 04, 2011, 11:37:01 AM »
A quick Google on hylomecon seed produces a few pages saying that little or no seed is set, and one selling seed (out of stock):

http://www.rareplants.de/shop/prodtype.asp?CAT_ID=1213

which describes "Hylomecon (Wood Poppy), Stylomecon (Wind Poppy) & Stylophorum" together.
David Pilling at the seaside in North West England.

Lesley Cox

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Re: Are they fertile?
« Reply #28 on: July 04, 2011, 10:46:10 PM »
The Stylomecon looks very interesting, and nice. Then there's also Eomecon which has white flowers and wanders about, rampantly, if it likes the conditions. I think it looks like a very inferior form of Romneya.
Lesley Cox - near Dunedin, lower east coast, South Island of New Zealand - Zone 9

David Pilling

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Re: Are they fertile?
« Reply #29 on: July 04, 2011, 11:19:10 PM »
I grew stylomecon this year (from a different source). A small poppy (about 3 inches high) which grew, flowered and set seed quickly (about 8 weeks). Very bright flowers. A bit of a contrast to taking 7 years from seed to flower.
« Last Edit: July 05, 2011, 12:25:13 AM by David Pilling »
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